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Post by WKU-Perrone-76 on Apr 18, 2011 23:36:48 GMT -6
The fact of the matter is that the rule was voted on and it was changed. Although not everyone may agree on it, the fact stands that the rule was changed. We'll play with it for the 2011-2012 season, and if it is not to everyone's satisfaction come April 2012, we'll change it again. It's not constructive to come on here and complain about the rules. Although it may not be the way you wanted it, 10 of the 17 teams represented at the captain's meeting did. I didn't like that Obama got elected, but I am dealing with it; now that everyone has seen (or will see) what has become of the situation, it may have been the best thing for the country (or the league) because we'll realize "OHHHHH NOOOO!!! What were we thinking??!?!?!" Or We'll say "You know, this just might work."
Once we play a few actual games in the fall we will be able to determine an actual opinion about the new version of the game. Until then, there's nothing you can really base these assumptions on. Who knows, this may actually make the game more intense in the first 20 seconds. Maybe it won't be an intense opening rush, but the plays immediately following the rush will be exciting. Such as trying to intercept the other teams relay or throw-back pass.
We will see in the fall, until then, there's no use complaining about something that can't be changed for a year.
Just my $0.02
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 18, 2011 23:42:50 GMT -6
I have to say though, I don't think that there was a good enough arguement provided for keeping the rule the same at the captians meeting. It was only Jimmy standing up there arguing against the opening rush. I think if we had actually had time and sat down and actually talked about it we would no have changed it. lol
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Post by x502xedgex on Apr 19, 2011 7:28:04 GMT -6
The fact of the matter is that the rule was voted on and it was changed. Although not everyone may agree on it, the fact stands that the rule was changed. We'll play with it for the 2011-2012 season, and if it is not to everyone's satisfaction come April 2012, we'll change it again. It's not constructive to come on here and complain about the rules. Although it may not be the way you wanted it, 10 of the 17 teams represented at the captain's meeting did. I didn't like that Obama got elected, but I am dealing with it; now that everyone has seen (or will see) what has become of the situation, it may have been the best thing for the country (or the league) because we'll realize "OHHHHH NOOOO!!! What were we thinking??!?!?!" Or We'll say "You know, this just might work." Once we play a few actual games in the fall we will be able to determine an actual opinion about the new version of the game. Until then, there's nothing you can really base these assumptions on. Who knows, this may actually make the game more intense in the first 20 seconds. Maybe it won't be an intense opening rush, but the plays immediately following the rush will be exciting. Such as trying to intercept the other teams relay or throw-back pass. We will see in the fall, until then, there's no use complaining about something that can't be changed for a year. Just my $0.02 you cant say that this is like voting for a president when the only people that vote on the rule change are the captains and not everyone in the league. im not trying to argue here lol im just saying that when we elect a president the nation gets to decide, not just three people from each state. and this subfourm is to discuss rule changes, not make them change so i dont see why people cant come on here and speak what they think especially seeing as how the players didnt get to voice their opinions at a captains meeting or anything or even allow their captain to talk to the team before something like this happened, especially when the topic at hand was passed by something as close a 3 votes. and who all were at these meetings? was it JUST captains or were alternative captains there also, and were there only allowed so many because if not then some teams have more then others and some less, so how is it exactly fair if all the teams, which only should have 20 players on a roster have different amounts of captains and alternative captains that can cause a vote to sway one way or another? felix im not trying to piss you off, nor am i trying to step on anyones toes, i just dont want this to become boring or anything. dodgeball is something that i look forward to way to much and if it becomes boring im gonna be upset. and the fact that we dont really have an assumption on what is going to become of the game its easy to see what can be when you think of things being better, but it could be something that makes the game boring for a while until it picks up, then slows down at the end again. im just trying to paint the whole picture and not focus on what could be. i agree, until we play, or at least pratice enough or with enough people to make a definite decision we cant really know. but i believed that there was nothing wrong with our method before, aside from an injury every now and then but those injurys were due to overcrowding or other things, things that could be changed to satisfy the style off the break but still lower the amount of injuries that happen. its just change, and when you change something theres going to be people that dont like it, and theres going to be some that want to speak against it. the only reason im speaking against it is because i didnt have a voice to begin with.
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Post by stokesj on Apr 20, 2011 10:08:59 GMT -6
When we were at the captains meeting I suggested many different things we could do with the rush. I started off with the most drastic change; a simple coin flip decides who starts with 6 at the beginning of the point and that number changes between points. Only 2 or 3 teams liked that idea. I then suggested we put 3 balls on each team's throw line with 4 balls in the middle and doing the opening rush that way. Few people liked that idea, so we went with lining up 5 balls on each throw line and there was a majority consensus that we would change the run up to that. In my opinion I'm very happy with what's been done. I know it's not the "best" result but in order to come up with the best dodgeball possible sometimes major changes need to happen. For example, when we instituted the 15 count. That was a huge change to the game and some teams argued that it changed the game too much, it wasn't fun because it would change their style of play.
If you wanted to change the run up I would suggest making the dodgeballs instantly live, that way if you have someone that's quick you just have then run up, grab it and quickly fire it off at someone. Or what you could do is what I suggested earlier where you line up 3 on each throw line and 4 in the middle and make the balls live instantly so it's like a duel to get those balls in the middle.
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 13:33:55 GMT -6
If you wanted to change the run up I would suggest making the dodgeballs instantly live, that way if you have someone that's quick you just have then run up, grab it and quickly fire it off at someone. JIMMY! Dude I love the idea of making the balls live instantly when they are laid out across the throwing lines. I honestly think there needs to be a discussion about this for next season. I know we did take a while talking about it in the captians meeting this year, but I feel like it was almost to quickly moved through to really have a good discussion about it. I think more people would like the idea of making the balls live instantly with the current rule change we made. So maybe we should try and get a vote going and see what people think. I really don't think people are going to be happy running up for the balls, then running back the their end line, then beginning the game. It almost seems like a waist of time, but to make the balls live would change the game plan big time.
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Post by hiller 87 on Apr 20, 2011 13:57:00 GMT -6
We can't change anything until the next captain's meeting though.
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Post by brogers003 on Apr 20, 2011 14:00:18 GMT -6
there were alternate captains there, but in regards to how many captains each team had there, it didn't matter because each team was allowed the same number of votes
also anyone who pays attention to the forums has known that there has been discussion about this for a good while now, and while i understand that mabey all members of the league didn't know there was going to be a vote, I feel like there was reasonable amounts of information out there that a team member could talk to their captain/ alternate captians about what they think...
also captains are supposed to represent their teams the best they can just like an elected official... there are many things in our government that we don't like, but our officials that we have voted into power choose it, and we just have to deal with it sometimes...
I agree with Felix... just stick it out, see how it works and if its horrible, we'll re discuss next year...
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Post by brogers003 on Apr 20, 2011 14:03:12 GMT -6
you cant say that this is like voting for a president when the only people that vote on the rule change are the captains and not everyone in the league. im not trying to argue here lol im just saying that when we elect a president the nation gets to decide, not just three people from each state. Just saying that although everyone in the country gets to vote for the presidential elections, their votes don't actually matter, because its the electorial college votes that really get someone elected and although the electorial college is supposed to vote based on what the voters said, this is not always so sorry i just read that and was like... waittt... lol
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Post by x502xedgex on Apr 20, 2011 14:14:46 GMT -6
anything is better then what is happening now.
and the 15 second rule was made so that people cant just sleeper the balls or make people throw because their behind a point. those that complained on it messing up their style of play more then likely played that way.
this is something that wont change the style of play just make the game boring from the start then it will pick up, but then get boring again when its like 2v2 or anything like that.
but this kinda shows that captains shouldn't be the only people that decide on these matters. that captains need to talk to their teams, and players should have a say also. i feel that this wouldn't be a big deal to me if it was voted in by the league, and not just a handful of captains from each team.
but making balls live instanly wont help the situation at hand. because then people will complain that faster teams will dominate, if you can beat someone there then whats the point of running? faster teams will end up with 80-90% of the balls every time, and yes that may be the case now to, but at least when it happens in the opening rush we have now they cant instantly take out up to 5 players in 20 seconds.
just because you make the balls live at the start doesnt make things better, in fact it could make things worse. wait till someone like sweet, or curtis from cmu, or number 11 from SVSU, or nick from wku, who are fast but also have an arm on them get a hold of a ball and blast someone point blank in the face, see if an injury comes from that.
any way you slice it, theres going to be drawbacks to all this situation. i still say that we focus on fine tuning the way we have it already instead of making it completely different. such as: 1-limiting the number of people that can run on each team 2-actually giving penalties that hold some weight instead of point a finger and saying next time ill call it 3-set in stone what is illegal on the opening rush not just give examples 4-captians talk to your players and go over with them what is what, players listen and learn how to do it right.
but im down to give anything a chance, but seriously this way we have it now, the 5 on each side....it really just does not look like something that is going to make the game better in the long run.
and as for this information being there, i know that on our team theres only 3 of us that actually know or use these forums, maybe 4.
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Post by brogers003 on Apr 20, 2011 14:23:04 GMT -6
and as for this information being there, i know that on our team theres only 3 of us that actually know or use these forums, maybe 4. I know not everyone reads the forums, but if you know that most of your team doesn't know whats going on, have someone be the relay man and fill them in. This is what happened on our team i know... I am the only member of our team (besides one post from yasser) that i think has ever been on the forums let alone be active on them, but I make it a point to relay things that are going on as much as I can to the rest of the team at meetings/practices
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 14:26:38 GMT -6
We say we can't change it now, but is there anything in the rulebook that says rules can only be changed during the weekend of Nationals? There isn't.
We shouldn't have to sit here and stick it out if the rule sucks. We should be able to change it. So in some way shape or form this needs to go down. No one is playing any kinda of dodgeball that matters until the next school year. So I'm confused as to why this cannot change?
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Post by Zigmister on Apr 20, 2011 14:32:27 GMT -6
We can't change anything until the next captain's meeting though. I'd would rather not be limited to the National's Captains' Meeting. That meeting sucked in general, because everyone had played 3 games that day, most likely had been up since 7am, possibly had experienced some major injuries on their team, and the rest wanted to get back to the hotel to either sleep or party. Few were paying attention and I know I couldn't say all I wanted to say. It's a shoddy way of conducting the business of the league. I have an idea/draft of how policy can be decided in the league, but I haven't been able to finish it up yet. I would post it up, but I typed it on a typewriter. the on topic tangent: I think the Stall Clock proposal would complement the new opening rush.
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 14:38:06 GMT -6
At least someone agrees with me about the Captains Meeting being a joke. lol No one wanted to be there and that's why I think there needs to be another one in some way. That way every idea and controversy can be brought up and actually talked about rather than just swept under the rug.
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Post by brogers003 on Apr 20, 2011 14:52:43 GMT -6
BTW... i'm confused... i just read through everything and a bunch of people said its 5 on 5 at neutral zones... correct me if I'm wrong but I though we voted on the 3:4:3 set up?
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Post by brogers003 on Apr 20, 2011 14:55:30 GMT -6
ok never mind my bad... aparently i wasn't all there at the captains meeting lol (or i zoned out at that moment)
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