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Post by willhack on Apr 20, 2011 14:57:25 GMT -6
I don't see any problem with changing the rules during the offseason, although every school would obviously have to have a say in the decision.
As for making the balls live immediately, I think that might be a bit better for the beginning of the game. I think each team would still get 5 balls, but some people might throw right away hoping for a quick snipe and that would add some variation.
Any argument based on "it's not fair because fast teams have an advantage" is dumb. If you are fast, then you SHOULD get an advantage.
But I do think that there was a good reason behind the change, because anything we can do to reduce injuries is a positive step.
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Post by Dylan Fettig on Apr 20, 2011 15:01:11 GMT -6
I like the ideas of of either having the balls live from the throw lines or only being allowed to have five people run up after the balls on the mid-court line.
And I agree about the captain's meeting being unreliable. By the end of the meeting people just wanted to get out of there and the people trying to talk were not getting any respect or attention.
Also, when your team picks a team captain you are choosing the person who you believe is going to represent your team the best. Their vote is essentially your vote, if you don't trust them to make the right decision than don't choose them as your captain.
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 15:15:22 GMT -6
I don't see any problem with changing the rules during the offseason, although every school would obviously have to have a say in the decision. As for making the balls live immediately, I think that might be a bit better for the beginning of the game. I think each team would still get 5 balls, but some people might throw right away hoping for a quick snipe and that would add some variation. Any argument based on "it's not fair because fast teams have an advantage" is dumb. If you are fast, then you SHOULD get an advantage. But I do think that there was a good reason behind the change, because anything we can do to reduce injuries is a positive step. I like the ideas of of either having the balls live from the throw lines or only being allowed to have five people run up after the balls on the mid-court line. And I agree about the captain's meeting being unreliable. By the end of the meeting people just wanted to get out of there and the people trying to talk were not getting any respect or attention. Also, when your team picks a team captain you are choosing the person who you believe is going to represent your team the best. Their vote is essentially your vote, if you don't trust them to make the right decision than don't choose them as your captain. At least some people have their head on straight. hahahaha
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mtrip8
Junior Member
Posts: 62
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Post by mtrip8 on Apr 20, 2011 16:08:43 GMT -6
Yes the circumstances with the captains meeting sets it up to fail with everyone being tired and wanting to be finished for the day etc. and i can agree with all of that, as I feel most people will as well.
I also like the idea for rule changes to happen elsewhere beside the captains meeting. That being said If anyone has a idea for a place/way for all the Captains to be able to discuss rule changes as a group at the same time to get all proposals and counter arguments(ie. oovoo video conference or some chat room, idk just random ideas). As well as maybe setting 2 or 3 dates/ few day time frames in the season where rule changes can happen and can try to be implemented immediately I would be all for it.
And Yes I was all for changing the run up but I feel like the topic needed much more discussion time to give the best possible outcome. I do like the idea of With the 5 balls on each neutral zone line being live on contact by a player.
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 16:21:49 GMT -6
Maybe have someone talk to each captain/president individually presenting them with every proposed rule. Have them vote on which they like the most add then tally up the votes and then determine which is going to be the rule for the 2011-2012 season.
Maybe this is where we need a commissioner... even though everyone shot it down during the captians meeting.(Cause everyone wanted to leave) lol
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Post by Zigmister on Apr 20, 2011 16:46:03 GMT -6
that is what I'm going to do McCarthy, via email. There's a whole system, not completely done writing it up.
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Post by x502xedgex on Apr 20, 2011 16:47:20 GMT -6
ok never mind my bad... aparently i wasn't all there at the captains meeting lol (or i zoned out at that moment) point exactly. the fact that the league only goes through changes one weekend, a weekend in which more dodgeball is played then any other time int he weekend is a joke. especially when the meeting is held before the games and everyone just wants to play dodgeball. or after when everyones just ready to get on the road and back home. there needs to be a forum, much like the captains thread where people can read it, but only certain people can post in it. i think that in the off season is when rules can be changed, and talked about.
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Post by x502xedgex on Apr 20, 2011 16:51:13 GMT -6
Maybe have someone talk to each captain/president individually presenting them with every proposed rule. Have them vote on which they like the most add then tally up the votes and then determine which is going to be the rule for the 2011-2012 season. Maybe this is where we need a commissioner... even though everyone shot it down during the captians meeting.(Cause everyone wanted to leave) lol MCCARTHY FOR COMMISSIONER! lol
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 17:29:02 GMT -6
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I'm not paying him, I SWEAR! hahahaha
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Post by stokesj on Apr 20, 2011 20:23:58 GMT -6
So McCarthy, Bomis, and myself were having a mini-discussion. If we do the 3-4-3 ball lineup (for those of you that weren't at the captains meeting 3 on neutral, 4 in middle, 3 on other neutral) and have the balls be live immediately. Then an epic battle will ensue for those remaining 4 balls in the middle. Personally I think that's the coolest and most exciting thing to do while removing the injury risk of the run up.
In my opinion changing the rules during the summer would be fine. That way people can mull over what was discussed at the captains meeting and would allow people to try out the discussed changes. I don't know if every captain/assistant captain are on fb, but I know there's the Captain's Club on facebook. That would be a good place where only the captains could have a discussion about rule changes. This would be a good time and place where a possible rule change (such as this one) could happen. Again, I would strongly suggest to remove the run up where people recklessly run towards each other and instead go with the 3-4-3 set up and make all balls live immediately. I highly doubt someone would run headlong to the 4 balls while the other team has 3 balls ready to destroy them. This would be a good time (off season) to try out the 5-0-5 or 3-4-3 or some other random ball situation.
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Post by stokesj on Apr 20, 2011 20:24:48 GMT -6
Also, if you have the 4 balls in the middle you could gather in the center court and have a dance off for them. Just a suggestion.
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Post by mccarthy55cmu on Apr 20, 2011 20:36:25 GMT -6
So basically captains need to practice the 3-4-3 and the 5-0-5 where the balls are live instantly. Then we can make a decision on that.
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Post by stokesj on Apr 20, 2011 20:48:24 GMT -6
To all you captains out there in dodgeball land, I posted a discussion on the NCDA Captains Club site on FB where we can have discussions away from the forum.
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Post by trippiedigv12 on Apr 22, 2011 22:46:42 GMT -6
We tried out a number of these today. Heres the cliff notes version:
-All "balls are immediately live" variations offer a satisfactory alternative to having two parties run headlong at the balls in the center. Which is to say, making the balls immediately live will make you wonder why there were ever ten balls in the middle to begin with.
-In a 3-4-3 formation where the balls are live on contact, the game develops in a way as to where the more aggressive team will always begin with the 7-3 advantage. This could be problematic for more passive, defense-oriented teams. If a slower team with a smaller quantity of dominant arms runs past the first line of balls, they are easily picked off by the other team.
-the 5-0-5 formation, again, balls live on contact, gives a passive team more of a chance to counter a strategy by an aggressive team, and is thusly, more fair to start. But if you have two passive teams playing each other, you essentially run into the issue that people complained about in having to return the balls, which is that no one throws off the run up.
I would say that the 3-4-3 (balls are live) is the most exciting version of the run-up to date. Then the 5-0-5 (balls are live) is a close second. Followed by the monstrosity of the 0-10-0, and finally the current rule of 5-0-5 (balls not live until returned) which is the least exciting.
Not having to return the balls completely changes the run-up for the better, but I would keep in mind that the whole thing with starting 5-5 is that it prevents a situation where one team always has the ball advantage to start in every point. Then again, we may foster aggression on both sides, and get the best of both worlds.
Officially I say: the quicker you can get balls in players hands the better. I like a lot of aspects of starting with live balls. Probably not enough to change the rule as it currently stands, but if enough people are worried about an exciting first seven seconds of the match (because clearly, no one agrees with me that we should try to make the rest of the game more exciting), live balls are the way to go.
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